Bug or "feature"? Selector jumps unnecessarily

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eric_verboven
Posts: 23
Joined: 27.04.2015, 13:08

Bug or "feature"? Selector jumps unnecessarily

#1 Post by eric_verboven » 27.04.2015, 13:15

FreeCommander rocks.

After using it fairly extensively, I can come up with only one minor “annoyance”. It has to do with what happens when you manually edit a filename in the main pane (in Details view). Say, for instance, there are 20 filenames visible in your pane, of a total of a couple of hundred. You edit the 3rd name in the list. Even when your change doesn’t affect the alphabetical order of your file list, the selector (the bar, how do you call it) will “jump” to the bottom of the screen, still on the name of the file you just edited, but on a different location of your screen. This is confusing and unnecessary, especially if there are many filenames to edit.

I would like to know if this behaviour can be switched off somewhere? If not, I would consider this a “feature” which should be omitted (or at least made switchable) in future releases. After editing a filename, the selector should make no “jumps”. Can this be changed somewhere?

Thanks, and keep up the good (actually splendid!) work.

(I’m using FreeCommander XE 2015 Build 685 32-bit public. I tried the behaviour on 2 different installations)

Zorkoff
Posts: 112
Joined: 10.05.2011, 21:14
Location: Boston, MA

Re: Bug or "feature"? Selector jumps unnecessarily

#2 Post by Zorkoff » 27.04.2015, 13:54

I cannot confirm the behavior you reported.

I tested R-685 x32 on a Win 7 x64 system. I set up a folder with enough files to fill the file panel 2 times and set the details sort mode to filename. When I edited a file name, the file position would remain the same if the sort did NOT change; it would jump to a new position if the sort DID change (with the file still highlighted). These are expected behaviors.

eric_verboven
Posts: 23
Joined: 27.04.2015, 13:08

Re: Bug or "feature"? Selector jumps unnecessarily

#3 Post by eric_verboven » 27.04.2015, 15:01

Zorkoff wrote:I cannot confirm the behavior you reported.

I tested R-685 x32 on a Win 7 x64 system. I set up a folder with enough files to fill the file panel 2 times and set the details sort mode to filename. When I edited a file name, the file position would remain the same if the sort did NOT change; it would jump to a new position if the sort DID change (with the file still highlighted). These are expected behaviors.
Hi Zorkoff. Thanks for your reply. I'd like to show the situation in a picture, but I can't upload them from where I am. Just a boring description of the situation then :)
- Let’s use the left pane. There are a couple of hundred files in that folder.
- There is a file called “ck22.docx”, on the 7th place in the list, just “somewhere” in the list, not close to the top, not close to the bottom. Preceding file: ck21.docx. Next file: ck23.docx.
- I edit the name, turning it into “ck22-FINAL.docx”. I leave the filename editor with the return key.
- Immediately upon doing so, the screen changes. My edited name, ck22-FINAL.docx, jumps to the bottom of the screen, even though the alphabetic sequence did not change.

That’s the “jumping” I was talking about, which happens always, except when the file-to-be-edited is already at the bottom of the pane (not the file list, just the pane).
When you need to edit a lot of file names, this behaviour makes you go up and down the screen all the time, which is not really a disaster, but it is a bit “cumbersome”. Hence my search to turn this “feature” off. If only I knew where...

Timon
Posts: 708
Joined: 13.09.2012, 06:51

Re: Bug or "feature"? Selector jumps unnecessarily

#4 Post by Timon » 27.04.2015, 15:45

- I edit the name, turning it into “ck22-FINAL.docx”. I leave the filename editor with the return key.
- Immediately upon doing so, the screen changes. My edited name, ck22-FINAL.docx, jumps to the bottom of the screen, even though the alphabetic sequence did not change.
The problem is with your office software (I don't know what version and name of office suite you are using, but it is not important, all office suites have this problem).

If you use MS Office, when you try to edit “ck22-FINAL.docx”, temporary file is created (with hidden attributes) “~$22-FINAL.docx”
If you use Libre/OpenOffice, then other temporary file is created (I don't remember it's name).

So file manager "sees" that the number of files has changed. That's the reason of such "jumps".

eric_verboven
Posts: 23
Joined: 27.04.2015, 13:08

Re: Bug or "feature"? Selector jumps unnecessarily

#5 Post by eric_verboven » 27.04.2015, 16:43

Timon wrote:
- I edit the name, turning it into “ck22-FINAL.docx”. I leave the filename editor with the return key.
- Immediately upon doing so, the screen changes. My edited name, ck22-FINAL.docx, jumps to the bottom of the screen, even though the alphabetic sequence did not change.
The problem is with your office software (I don't know what version and name of office suite you are using, but it is not important, all office suites have this problem).

If you use MS Office, when you try to edit “ck22-FINAL.docx”, temporary file is created (with hidden attributes) “~$22-FINAL.docx”
If you use Libre/OpenOffice, then other temporary file is created (I don't remember it's name).

So file manager "sees" that the number of files has changed. That's the reason of such "jumps".
Timon wrote:
- I edit the name, turning it into “ck22-FINAL.docx”. I leave the filename editor with the return key.
- Immediately upon doing so, the screen changes. My edited name, ck22-FINAL.docx, jumps to the bottom of the screen, even though the alphabetic sequence did not change.
The problem is with your office software (I don't know what version and name of office suite you are using, but it is not important, all office suites have this problem).

If you use MS Office, when you try to edit “ck22-FINAL.docx”, temporary file is created (with hidden attributes) “~$22-FINAL.docx”
If you use Libre/OpenOffice, then other temporary file is created (I don't remember it's name).

So file manager "sees" that the number of files has changed. That's the reason of such "jumps".
Thanks for your reply, Timon. But I don't see why MS Office is involved. I happened to give an example in which an Office file was involved, but that doesn't matter: I wasn't editing the file in Office, but only editing the file name in FreeCommander. The "jumping-to-the-bottom-of-the-pane" also occurs when I rename a jpg, mp3 or whatever. No temporary files are being created, and the number of files doesn't change, also not temporarily. It's something which, to my knowledge, is strictly related to FreeCommander only.

eric_verboven
Posts: 23
Joined: 27.04.2015, 13:08

Re: Bug or "feature"? Selector jumps unnecessarily

#6 Post by eric_verboven » 27.04.2015, 18:45

I just noticed that another topic - http://forum.freecommander.com/viewtopi ... lit=rename - is dealing with something similar. No solution came up there, however.

Zorkoff
Posts: 112
Joined: 10.05.2011, 21:14
Location: Boston, MA

Re: Bug or "feature"? Selector jumps unnecessarily

#7 Post by Zorkoff » 28.04.2015, 15:34

eric_verboven wrote:
- I edit the name, turning it into “ck22-FINAL.docx”. I leave the filename editor with the return key.
- Immediately upon doing so, the screen changes. My edited name, ck22-FINAL.docx, jumps to the bottom of the screen, even though the alphabetic sequence did not change.

That’s the “jumping” I was talking about, which happens always, except when the file-to-be-edited is already at the bottom of the pane (not the file list, just the pane).
I completely understand what you are describing. However, as I said about my test I cannot duplicate this action.

Maybe if you could give a more complete description of how this occurs, like:
1. What version of Windows are you using? 32 or 64 bit version?
2. Does this happen with local drives or network drives?
3. Does this happen at all tree levels (C:\, C:\dir1, C:\Dir1\Dir2)?
4. What file display are you using (I assumed Details display with tree in both right and left pane)?
5. What column sort are you using?
6. In settings are you using Windows or FreeCommander functions?
7. What settings are you using in the in the File/Folder List section?
8. Does this happen with less than 200 files in a folder (say 2 display list lengths)?

This data will give us more to go on in trying to duplicate your problem.

Zorkoff
Posts: 112
Joined: 10.05.2011, 21:14
Location: Boston, MA

Re: Bug or "feature"? Selector jumps unnecessarily

#8 Post by Zorkoff » 28.04.2015, 15:46

I just thought of another possibility. Windows has a strange way of sorting filenames containing special characters.

In your example, you changed Ck22.docx to Ck22-FINAL.docx Try changing it to Ck22_FINAL.docx

Using the Underscore character in place of the Dash character can change the sort.

So to my previous list of questions, please give an example of where the renamed file is sorted in the list after you renamed it.

eric_verboven
Posts: 23
Joined: 27.04.2015, 13:08

Re: Bug or "feature"? Selector jumps unnecessarily

#9 Post by eric_verboven » 29.04.2015, 09:54

Zorkoff wrote:
eric_verboven wrote:
- I edit the name, turning it into “ck22-FINAL.docx”. I leave the filename editor with the return key.
- Immediately upon doing so, the screen changes. My edited name, ck22-FINAL.docx, jumps to the bottom of the screen, even though the alphabetic sequence did not change.

That’s the “jumping” I was talking about, which happens always, except when the file-to-be-edited is already at the bottom of the pane (not the file list, just the pane).
I completely understand what you are describing. However, as I said about my test I cannot duplicate this action.

Maybe if you could give a more complete description of how this occurs, like:
1. What version of Windows are you using? 32 or 64 bit version?
2. Does this happen with local drives or network drives?
3. Does this happen at all tree levels (C:\, C:\dir1, C:\Dir1\Dir2)?
4. What file display are you using (I assumed Details display with tree in both right and left pane)?
5. What column sort are you using?
6. In settings are you using Windows or FreeCommander functions?
7. What settings are you using in the in the File/Folder List section?
8. Does this happen with less than 200 files in a folder (say 2 display list lengths)?

This data will give us more to go on in trying to duplicate your problem.
1. Windows 7 Enterprise on one computer, Windows 8.? on another.
2. I'm only using local drives.
3. Yes, it happens on all tree levels
4. Dual Pane display, no Tree, Details, in both panes.
5. Not sure what you mean by "column sorting". My files are (usually) sorted on File name. The column order is (usually): Name, Size Auto, Modified, Type.
6. In Settings > File/Folder operations, I found that I am using Windows for Delete, Copy and Move
7. The "Refresh" tab of the File/folder List section looks as if it is the place where the culprit could be located, but changes here don't have any effect. I am now using "Auto Refresh" for both "General" and "Other" changes. Switching that one to off doesn't appear to make any difference. The "jumping" occurs in both cases.
8. I have not been able to verify all situations, but the "jump" does happen in a folder with some 500 files, with the right hand "scroll bar" somewhere in the middle, following a renaming operation (without affecting the alphabetic order) on a file somewhere in the middle of the folder.

So, what I'm looking for is a "partial" (and to my opinion logical) type of refresh, i.e. Do show the new name in the list, but do Not throw that new name to the bottom of my display pane if no resorting or something like that is taking place.

Actually, what I am looking for, is the behaviour of Windows own File Explorer. When you change a file name there, the new name is shown, but the overall display doesn't change.

eric_verboven
Posts: 23
Joined: 27.04.2015, 13:08

Re: Bug or "feature"? Selector jumps unnecessarily

#10 Post by eric_verboven » 29.04.2015, 09:59

Zorkoff wrote:I just thought of another possibility. Windows has a strange way of sorting filenames containing special characters.

In your example, you changed Ck22.docx to Ck22-FINAL.docx Try changing it to Ck22_FINAL.docx

Using the Underscore character in place of the Dash character can change the sort.

So to my previous list of questions, please give an example of where the renamed file is sorted in the list after you renamed it.
The renamed file is not moved to another place in the list - because no resorting is taking place. Only the display "jumps", putting the renamed file at the bottom of my display pane. The order is still correct, everything is correct, Except for the "jumping" part. Compare it to this editing window I'm using on this forum right now: corrections are shown, but correcting does not cause your corrected line to jump to the bottom of your editing window. It is exactly that what I would like FreeCommander to do also: show the new name, and nothing more, no jumping, no moving... * sigh *

Zorkoff
Posts: 112
Joined: 10.05.2011, 21:14
Location: Boston, MA

Re: Bug or "feature"? Selector jumps unnecessarily

#11 Post by Zorkoff » 29.04.2015, 13:38

5. Not sure what you mean by "column sorting". My files are (usually) sorted on File name.
That is exactly what column sorting means. If you click on a column header, the sort will change to that attribute. Multiple clicks will change between descending and ascending sort order.

Your answers to the questions are very much as I expected. The only variable in the situation is the number of files in the folder.

Try creating a folder with about 50 files and see if the jumping still occurs. This may be a problem with FreeCommander handling folder displays with a large number of files. Beyond that, I am not sure what more to suggest.

Personally, if a folder on my computer fills more than one screen in the file display, I break it into smaller folders. I have never put 500 files in one folder.

eric_verboven
Posts: 23
Joined: 27.04.2015, 13:08

Re: Bug or "feature"? Selector jumps unnecessarily

#12 Post by eric_verboven » 30.04.2015, 23:27

As far as I can make out, the "jumping" problem (I suppose technically it's called a "refresh") only occurs in Detail View, not in List or in Small Icons view. In List and Small Icons, a refresh also happens (at least when you've activated it in your settings), but it behaves the way it should, i.e. the overall screen remains the same. In Detail View, however, the "jump" takes place. This is particularly annoying when you're editing a set of filenames, because it causes extra scrolling and extra keys. Suppose you want to rename File1, File2, File3 and File4, which are in the middle of your pane. When you rename File1 to become File0, File0 moves to the bottom of your pane, and File2, File3 and File4 are below the edge of the pane, necessitating scrolling.

(Sorry about all my verbose descriptions of the problem, but it IS a bit irritating when you have a good deal of renaming work in large folders).

Marek
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Re: Bug or "feature"? Selector jumps unnecessarily

#13 Post by Marek » 02.05.2015, 18:09

Fixed for the next release.

eric_verboven
Posts: 23
Joined: 27.04.2015, 13:08

Re: Bug or "feature"? Selector jumps unnecessarily

#14 Post by eric_verboven » 06.05.2015, 07:20

Marek wrote:Fixed for the next release.
That's what I call good news!! Thanks for the good work, Marek. Looking forward to the next release of a wonderful piece of software.

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